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Thread: initial 8 hour charge

  1. #11
    Ratchet
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    It seems like charging it to 100% would be enough.

    But why do so many manufacturers still recommend their Li-Ions to be charged for 8+ hours the first time it's used?

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by beginning View Post
    It seems like charging it to 100% would be enough.

    But why do so many manufacturers still recommend their Li-Ions to be charged for 8+ hours the first time it's used?
    To ensure that the battery is fully charged and the smart charger is calibrated. I'm sure they get that advice from the battery manufacturer.
    MA83 likes this.

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Swipe View Post
    This is from Battery University:


    Similar to a mechanical device that wears out faster with heavy use, so also does the depth of discharge (DoD) determine the cycle count. The shorter the discharge (low DoD), the longer the battery will last. If at all possible, avoid full discharges and charge the battery more often between uses. Partial discharge on Li-ion is fine; there is no memory and the battery does not need periodic full discharge cycles to prolong life, other than to calibrate the fuel gauge on a smart battery once in a while.

    ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    I suggest reading the articles in Battery University that apply to the Li-ion batteries used in tablets. The Battery Use Guide in my signature links to a thread that also has a wealth of tips and information.

    Basic to Advanced Battery Information from Battery University

    Also see post #9 in this thread:

    http://www.transformerforums.com/for...ps-tricks.html
    I don't know that I agree with that. I mean, I guess that in a strictly literal sense, if the battery life is determined by how much you discharge and recharge it, then it stands to reason that the less you do that the longer it will last... But that's like saying that if you just drive your car to work and back 5 miles each way, that your car will last longer than if you drive it 100 miles each day and go off roading on the weekend. LOL

    Discharge RATE tends to affect the battery more, as that is what generates heat, which causes damage to the cells over time.

    I still think that this is outdated info, and just because it is on the internet, people buy into it.

    I see the same thing with people making claims that you have to break in a motor gently on a new motorcycle... that you shouldn't go over 6000rpm till after 1,000 miles, and then not over a certain RPM until 1,500 miles, etc... That's based on info from the 1970's. With today's modern materials and manufacturing tolerances, you can break a motor in hard and it will actually be better for the motor. Hell, Kawasaki takes each brand new assembled motor and puts it on a dyno, plugs in the fluid hoses and runs the piss out of it to redline to see what the power output is, etc... If beating on a 10 minute old motor doesn't blow it up, you won't on the street either. In fact, getting the motor up to higher pressures does a better job of seating the rings to the cylinder walls and yields higher compression and more power. But people still read these online sources and quote it as gospel even though it has been debunked 100 times.

    I believe that if you just plug the thing in and use it, you will be fine. The notion of there being some "special trick" to charging it the first time to get a better charge or life is more internet folklore than anything, but to each their own...

  4. #14
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    not just internet folklore, the official manual of the T100 states that u have to plug it in for 8 hours before first use.
    anyway, i've let it plugged in for 6 hours or so because I didnt see the point of lettin it sit in any longer
    cause the led indicated the device was already fully charged after 2 hours.

    battery seems fine. i got around 10 hours.
    my old acer netbook's battery's capacity dropped after each use. i dont remember the name of the program i measured it with,
    but i think it was accurate. because it consistently kept getting worse and worse.

    seeing how my old netbooks battery detoriated so quickly, I plan on not fully discharging and fully charging this T100... and follow battery university principles. discharge to 20% and charge to 90% as much as possible.

    when using the T100 at home. is it really recommended to not keep it plugged in at 100%?

    because i read on this forum that some guy had a laptop plugged in for 2 years and never discharged it and when he needed it once it still had the fully advertised 6hours of use which is amazing for a 2 year old battery

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    Actually it isn't how many times you recharge it, it is "total cycles", this means from 100% to 0% and back.

    1000 cycles from 100% to 0% with a lithium ion battery is nearly the same wear has 5,000 cycles from 100% to 80% and back. The two determinants are how quickly you charge/discharge the battery (faster is worse for overall cell life/health), the next is how close to 100% or 0% you get.

    Lithium Ion cells have the longest overall battery life kept near 70% or stored at 70%.

    In general once you start getting over about 90% charge, you start impacting battery life as the charge from 90-100% is "less than ideal" because you can and do start to form impurities in the cell. Slow charging helps prevent this (which is why almost all Lithium Ion devices charge much slower once they hit about 85-90%, to preserve battery health).

    Also too deep of a discharge can kill the cells.

    For maximum battery life, you are probably best off using it between 90-10% and generally not letting it get above or below this amount. That said, it might only mean eeking 10-15% better battery longevity/health out of the cells in the long run.

  6. #16
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    What I can testify to is that on my TF101 ASUS Android tablet...that fellow stays plugged into the charger anytime I'm NOT using it...including overnight 7 days a week.

    I've read numerous studies that actually contradict each other on the whole "charge at 40%, charge at 80%, charge whenever possible debate". What I've learned is that many of those studies are based on theory, in contrast to lab results.

    After more than 2 1/2 years...the battery on the TF101 (it actually has 2 including the 2nd one in the keyboard dock) still holds a solid 100% charge, still gives me more than 10 hours battery life per charge, and continues without any battery issues. I can still go 4-5 days of travel without having to charge that tablet at all.

    I know of at least a dozen others who do the very same things - keep it all the time when not in use. No problems for any of these folks either.

    As for that TF101...it's virtually the same lithium ion battery composition as the T100.

    I'm also aware of at least 6-7 other tablet manufacturer owners of other brands that do the very same thing.

    So in the real world...I've seen no evidence whatsoever that you can't keep the unit charged regularly or for long periods of time.
    OWNER OF ASUS 64GB T100TA w/128GB microSD, and now running Windows 10

  7. #17
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    Well, according to you and the battery university, I am doing everything wrong. To date, I finally had to replace a single battery on one laptop this year. The original one lasted me well over 4 years of "doing everything wrong"...

    This tablet will be outdated or broken long before the battery gives out from charging it over 90% or letting it go under 15%... As is the case for 99% of the people out there...

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASUSFAN0001 View Post
    What I can testify to is that on my TF101 ASUS Android tablet...that fellow stays plugged into the charger anytime I'm NOT using it...including overnight 7 days a week.

    I've read numerous studies that actually contradict each other on the whole "charge at 40%, charge at 80%, charge whenever possible debate". What I've learned is that many of those studies are based on theory, in contrast to lab results.

    After more than 2 1/2 years...the battery on the TF101 (it actually has 2 including the 2nd one in the keyboard dock) still holds a solid 100% charge, still gives me more than 10 hours battery life per charge, and continues without any battery issues. I can still go 4-5 days of travel without having to charge that tablet at all.

    I know of at least a dozen others who do the very same things - keep it all the time when not in use. No problems for any of these folks either.

    As for that TF101...it's virtually the same lithium ion battery composition as the T100.

    I'm also aware of at least 6-7 other tablet manufacturer owners of other brands that do the very same thing.

    So in the real world...I've seen no evidence whatsoever that you can't keep the unit charged regularly or for long periods of time.
    Exactly! For having been into things that require batteries(laptops, phones, tablets and R/C cars) for about 25 years, this has proven to be the case... People can theorize all they want, the reality is that it doesn't really pan out that way. And even a lab test, there are different tolerances between different cells. It's not an exact science to begin with...
    ASUSFAN0001 likes this.

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by SquireSCA View Post
    Exactly! For having been into things that require batteries(laptops, phones, tablets and R/C cars) for about 25 years, this has proven to be the case... People can theorize all they want, the reality is that it doesn't really pan out that way. And even a lab test, there are different tolerances between different cells. It's not an exact science to begin with...
    I read in another thread on this topic that the chemistry of the newer batteries is superior to those lithium ion batteries of just a few years ago.

    Hopefully that's true...I have a 5 year old shaver with a lithium ion battery inside that sits in a charging stand 90% of the time...and when I take it traveling...it can hold a charge for 4-5 days before even showing any signs of not holding a charge. That's just one of 5 devices here with the same kind of battery and same kind of charging results.

    So if the poster is right...the batteries in the T100 should be able to be charged whenever and hold a charge for many years to come. Other than the very first charge to get the battery up to 100% the first time around...mine's staying plugged in whenever its not in use.
    OWNER OF ASUS 64GB T100TA w/128GB microSD, and now running Windows 10

  10. #20
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    The battery is Lithium-polymer, no difference from li-ion?

 

 
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